I'm considering a boat upgrade, maybe after the first of the year. I've been considering the Kenner but a 21VX owner told me the sides are weak and prone to crack if boat is pushed against a piling in the middle; too long a span and not enough support. The Kenner also has a small 35 gal fuel tank. The Blazer has a 50 gal tank. I like to take off for a weekend and camp out and fish and stay gone without having to go back to the dock for another load of expensive dock gas. I was told the Kenner VX series has 5 layers of glass while the Blazer Bay has 7. I think the hulls are pretty much the same shape and prices comparable. I'really leaning toward the Blazer with a tunnel, 150 HP outboard and hydraulic JP. I like the capability of these boats to go fairly shallow (7" ??) and also able to go offshore on select days for kings. I don't see the utility of a liner boat; you loose some interior space, more expensive, it's heavier and scuffs easier. What are your thoughts? Any other boat suggestions? Thanks
Blazer Bay 2170 VS Kenner 21VX
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Kenner Vision K2102
You might also want to consider the 21' Kenner Vision model K2102. It has a 60 gallon built in tank, and lots of storgae room under the 6 foot casting deck. With a 150 Merc, it'll run 50+ and it has proved to be a dry ride. Running 20 miles offshore proved to be a snap (62 miles total). We have fished four out of it on more than one occasion. It is available with a tunnel and it has a 200hp rating if you so desire.
When it comes to buying a boat, there are a lot of good models to chose from. As you narrow your search, maybe you can find someone with the model you are looking for to take you for a spin.
Good luck in your search.
NOTE: BTW, in the offshore pic below, that is a 151 qt Igloo sitting crosswise in the floor of the boat between the front deck and the livewell. And there is still enough room for someone to sit on the livewell seat and have floor space for your feet
Mike
You might also want to consider the 21' Kenner Vision model K2102. It has a 60 gallon built in tank, and lots of storgae room under the 6 foot casting deck. With a 150 Merc, it'll run 50+ and it has proved to be a dry ride. Running 20 miles offshore proved to be a snap (62 miles total). We have fished four out of it on more than one occasion. It is available with a tunnel and it has a 200hp rating if you so desire.
When it comes to buying a boat, there are a lot of good models to chose from. As you narrow your search, maybe you can find someone with the model you are looking for to take you for a spin.
Good luck in your search.
NOTE: BTW, in the offshore pic below, that is a 151 qt Igloo sitting crosswise in the floor of the boat between the front deck and the livewell. And there is still enough room for someone to sit on the livewell seat and have floor space for your feet
Mike
Thanks MT
The vision is a great boat, I've seen a couple and was impressed. That's another one I'm considering but I'm shying away from a liner boat; it looks great but I just don't see the utility of having a liner. Is there something I'm missing? Thanks
The vision is a great boat, I've seen a couple and was impressed. That's another one I'm considering but I'm shying away from a liner boat; it looks great but I just don't see the utility of having a liner. Is there something I'm missing? Thanks
Just curious what your upgrading from?
I have a Kenner 18v-135 (I think it is know the 18VX) and it has been good. I opted for it over the smaller Vision which is actually less than 18 ft (before the were making the 19.) I agree with you about the liners, but the one thing that I think might be better is the "hot foot factor". I have the gray deck and it gots hot to walk on, it seems like when I have been in liner boats they don't get as hot (but not sure if that's enough of a pro.)
Also, I couldn't believe the 21 only came with a 36 gallon tank, that's what my 18 has. Seems like you should be able to order that boat with a bigger tank. As for the cracking, I haven't ever heard of that and Kenner has been around for a while, but it does sound plausible.
One other thing about the Kenner's is that Bass Pro now owns them and I have heard so many negative things about them it makes me worry. I had always heard positive things about Kenner when when they were on there own. I do believe Mr. Kenner has started a new company and some people saw his new line at the summer boat show and said it looked good, but not really a skinny water boat. If you are waiting till the first of the year I'd go ahead and see what I could find at the boat show.
Good luck.
I have a Kenner 18v-135 (I think it is know the 18VX) and it has been good. I opted for it over the smaller Vision which is actually less than 18 ft (before the were making the 19.) I agree with you about the liners, but the one thing that I think might be better is the "hot foot factor". I have the gray deck and it gots hot to walk on, it seems like when I have been in liner boats they don't get as hot (but not sure if that's enough of a pro.)
Also, I couldn't believe the 21 only came with a 36 gallon tank, that's what my 18 has. Seems like you should be able to order that boat with a bigger tank. As for the cracking, I haven't ever heard of that and Kenner has been around for a while, but it does sound plausible.
One other thing about the Kenner's is that Bass Pro now owns them and I have heard so many negative things about them it makes me worry. I had always heard positive things about Kenner when when they were on there own. I do believe Mr. Kenner has started a new company and some people saw his new line at the summer boat show and said it looked good, but not really a skinny water boat. If you are waiting till the first of the year I'd go ahead and see what I could find at the boat show.
Good luck.
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Hi Gary, yes, the old Kenner was sold earlier this year. Thanks.
Mike
Mike
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MT,
Curious what set up you have on your boat. My fishing bud has an '01 2102 w/ 150 Merc, 17 pitch prop, no jackplate, and the best he can get is 45 @ 5600rpm on the GPS. That's in fishing trim with 2 adults. I've heard several people say they get 50+ out of that rig. Curious what he's doing wrong, or if the 50+ readings are GPS or not. We've had it 35 miles off before. The only bad thing I've noticed is the deck drains are below the water line at rest. Sucks when you want to wash the deck and the water can't drain.
Curious what set up you have on your boat. My fishing bud has an '01 2102 w/ 150 Merc, 17 pitch prop, no jackplate, and the best he can get is 45 @ 5600rpm on the GPS. That's in fishing trim with 2 adults. I've heard several people say they get 50+ out of that rig. Curious what he's doing wrong, or if the 50+ readings are GPS or not. We've had it 35 miles off before. The only bad thing I've noticed is the deck drains are below the water line at rest. Sucks when you want to wash the deck and the water can't drain.
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Honestly Whitecrow, I don't know the pitch of the prop. It is what Witt rigged the motor with. I has a great hole shot and good top end. It's a '03 model with 150 Merc and no jackplate. The day I ran it 53 mph (Garmin 176C) I had three adults and two teenagers in the boat, but only about 20 gallons of gas. I've run it 48 with 4 fisherpersons and gear.
I did see the deck drains at the water line, but I had all 215# of me leaning over the transom to take a look. Ordinarily there is no water in the floor and anything on the deck will drain out when I take off.
You are right about the 35 miles offshore thing. We ran 62 miles total and the tank still showed to be full. I need to fill up and do the calculations to figure out the mpg.
Mike
I did see the deck drains at the water line, but I had all 215# of me leaning over the transom to take a look. Ordinarily there is no water in the floor and anything on the deck will drain out when I take off.
You are right about the 35 miles offshore thing. We ran 62 miles total and the tank still showed to be full. I need to fill up and do the calculations to figure out the mpg.
Mike
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Is your GPS set to statute miles, or nautical miles (nm)? I just can't believe that a 150 will push it 53mph with 5 people on board. If it does, walk proud. Nothing we've been able to do will get my bud's boat much over 45. I looked at one with a 200EFI on it and the guy said top speed was 54.
Either way, it's a nice rig. Nice pix. Hope to be out there soon myself.
Either way, it's a nice rig. Nice pix. Hope to be out there soon myself.
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WC - I think he needs to re prop that boat or something.
I have a Kenner 21V with a 125 and can run 45 with 2 guys and gear with 5200 RPM. I think I have a 19 pitch on mine...
Another thing that could have happen if he can't get the RPM's over 4500. Some of these newer motors have a computer in them and if they get to high on RPM's they will set themselves to not go as high. You have to take them in and have the dealer reset it, this sometimes happens from jumping wakes and the motor comes all the way out of the water.
FN
I have a Kenner 21V with a 125 and can run 45 with 2 guys and gear with 5200 RPM. I think I have a 19 pitch on mine...
Another thing that could have happen if he can't get the RPM's over 4500. Some of these newer motors have a computer in them and if they get to high on RPM's they will set themselves to not go as high. You have to take them in and have the dealer reset it, this sometimes happens from jumping wakes and the motor comes all the way out of the water.
FN
jramm, I'm upgrading from......
a 98 model ProMaster 185 w/115 Johnson. It's been a good boat but I want something longer, sits higher in the water and better able to take the gulf. Looks to me like the 21VX is just a stretched 18VX which might account for the same fuel tank. Does anyone know if the Blazer 2170 is the same hull shape as the Kenner 21VX? From their websites it looks like the Kenner 2102 is about 400 lbs heavier because of the liner. To me that means it sits a little deeper in the water, less performance from a 150 and more weight for my pld pickup to tow. The 2170 is 3 inches longer but 2 inches narrower. Thanks for the comments everyone
a 98 model ProMaster 185 w/115 Johnson. It's been a good boat but I want something longer, sits higher in the water and better able to take the gulf. Looks to me like the 21VX is just a stretched 18VX which might account for the same fuel tank. Does anyone know if the Blazer 2170 is the same hull shape as the Kenner 21VX? From their websites it looks like the Kenner 2102 is about 400 lbs heavier because of the liner. To me that means it sits a little deeper in the water, less performance from a 150 and more weight for my pld pickup to tow. The 2170 is 3 inches longer but 2 inches narrower. Thanks for the comments everyone
You might want to take a look at the Nitro Bay boat as well. I kind of assumed the specs would be the same as the Kenner since they are owned by the same company, but I just looked and the beam is 8' 3'' (or 99" - wider than both the Kenner and Blazer.) It also comes with 44 gallon tank, which a little better than the 36 in the Kenner.
Not sure what your budget requirements are, but I would definately take a look at the Pathfinder's if I could.
Not sure what your budget requirements are, but I would definately take a look at the Pathfinder's if I could.
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Fishnut,
Read my original post again, I said he gets 45mph @ 5600rpm, which is the max rpm for the 150 Merc. It is propped right. Your VX is about 400lbs lighter than the 2102, which would account for you getting the same mph with 25 less hp.
I'm not trying to be a smarta$$, but I'd like to know if we can get my bud's boat to run better. I've been running the math and here's what I get. The 150 Merc has a 1.87:1 gear ratio. Putting the gear ratio, a 17p prop, @5600 rpm in the prop formulas yields a max possible speed of 48.19mph......assuming 100% efficiency, which is impossible. Dividing the real speed by the theoretical speed gives an efficiency of 93%. Any loss under 10% is pretty good. This coincides with my bud's finding of ~45mph top end. With a 19p prop, assuming the 150 would pull it and still achieve 5600rpm (highly unlikely), the formula yields a top possible speed of 53.8mph, again assuming 100% efficiency.
There are other variables to consider: water, weather, wind, hull condition, load, yada yada yada. The formulas just give the baseline and a starting point.
I'm still wondering if the GPS is set to nautical miles to yield a speed of 53.
Read my original post again, I said he gets 45mph @ 5600rpm, which is the max rpm for the 150 Merc. It is propped right. Your VX is about 400lbs lighter than the 2102, which would account for you getting the same mph with 25 less hp.
I'm not trying to be a smarta$$, but I'd like to know if we can get my bud's boat to run better. I've been running the math and here's what I get. The 150 Merc has a 1.87:1 gear ratio. Putting the gear ratio, a 17p prop, @5600 rpm in the prop formulas yields a max possible speed of 48.19mph......assuming 100% efficiency, which is impossible. Dividing the real speed by the theoretical speed gives an efficiency of 93%. Any loss under 10% is pretty good. This coincides with my bud's finding of ~45mph top end. With a 19p prop, assuming the 150 would pull it and still achieve 5600rpm (highly unlikely), the formula yields a top possible speed of 53.8mph, again assuming 100% efficiency.
There are other variables to consider: water, weather, wind, hull condition, load, yada yada yada. The formulas just give the baseline and a starting point.
I'm still wondering if the GPS is set to nautical miles to yield a speed of 53.
Jramm, the Pathfinder is definately out of my budget. I've been real interested in the Blazer 2220 which is a cheaper knockoff of the Pathfinder and a great boat. But it doesn't come with a tunnel, doesn't sit up as high as the 2170 and has a liner which I'm thinking i don't want. I'll look at the Nitros, thanks for the tip.
It sounded like you were looking for something without a liner, which made me think who all was making this style hull without the liner.
As for the Pathfinder, Ronnies Marine is advertising some '04 2200s for around $28k, not sure how that works in reality though.
I think I got a good deal on my 18 ft. Kenner but by the time I was done with all the additions it was still close to $20k, so I'm guessing you are looking at spending low to mid 20's on a 21 footer. Is that about right?
Also, on the tunnel front, just about everyone talked me out of the tunnel because of the lack of handling and top end speed loss. I can still get shallow enough to wade and run in some pretty skinny places. If I was going to be making offshore runs not sure if I'd want to make the sacrifice for a tunnel. Just my thoughts.
What's your timeframe for a purchase? Are you only looking to by new?
I love thinking and talking about getting new boats (my wife hates it, she thinks I should be happy with what I have.)
-Jason
As for the Pathfinder, Ronnies Marine is advertising some '04 2200s for around $28k, not sure how that works in reality though.
I think I got a good deal on my 18 ft. Kenner but by the time I was done with all the additions it was still close to $20k, so I'm guessing you are looking at spending low to mid 20's on a 21 footer. Is that about right?
Also, on the tunnel front, just about everyone talked me out of the tunnel because of the lack of handling and top end speed loss. I can still get shallow enough to wade and run in some pretty skinny places. If I was going to be making offshore runs not sure if I'd want to make the sacrifice for a tunnel. Just my thoughts.
What's your timeframe for a purchase? Are you only looking to by new?
I love thinking and talking about getting new boats (my wife hates it, she thinks I should be happy with what I have.)
-Jason
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I understand that Kenner was bought by the Bass Pro/Tracker Marine group and have starting having some serious quality control issues crop up. It seems that group buys established names like Mako, Kenner etc. and then lets the beancounters run rampant at the expense of the consumers...
I think they have owned them for at least a couple of years now, but Bill Kenner still ran the Kenner division for a while. I think he left a year or so ago and started another company. While I haven't heard of an quality problems it is certainly possible and is one thing that I worried about when I bought mine 2 years ago. I know that there have been a lot of problems regarding puchases made from Bass Pro, but that has been mostly around poor rigging of the boats. I haven't heard of any structural problems up to this point. You can still find a few independed Kenner dealers around and I think that is who you should buy from if you want one. I have not heard one good thing about dealing with Bass Pro. I just go out there to look because they always have a few in stock, where the smaller dealers may not. I would have another dealership order what I want.
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http://www.2coolfishing.net/ttmbforum/showthread.php?t=2832
If you want an unlined boat that will handle chop, the Triton is a good choice. I'm selling to buy a bigger one.
If you want an unlined boat that will handle chop, the Triton is a good choice. I'm selling to buy a bigger one.
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Bill Kenner who owned Kenner Boats does not work for Bass Proshop anymore. His contract was up or he quit or something but anyhow he is making a new boat. I would not by anything produced by Bass Pro Shop. Supposidly the new 04's are weak because at there factory possibly new it is set up to produce 6 boats a day and they are doing 16 so if that's true there goes there problem and thats from a pretty reputable source. Anyways the his new boat is called K2. It is supposed to be 21 or 22 ft. You can call Bartlett Motor Co. in Lake Jackson to see if there has arrived yet. There number is 979-297-2510. I would almost buy the boat without looking at it. Reason being is i have a 97 180V kenner and I love the boat and all of there old boat are outstandin and I know he produces quality for a good price.
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Check out the Blackjack and the Sea Pro at Witt's in Baytown...They are dry bay boats and the Sea Pro is in the price range of the Kenner(They used to rep)so they know it well. The Blackjack is the new addition from the Kenner's about a 30-32K range boat..The Sea hunt 21-22 ft w/150hp was $21,700 show special...about 6k off of regular..
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